(c) If conduct constituting an offense under this section also constitutes an offense under another . Another p320 "accidental discharge" - The Armory Life Forum Who function tests their firearm 1) with a round in the chamber, and 2) when its pointed at an extremity? Sig started out rough, but a lot of agencies have decided that their modular chassis system is the way of the future. Combine this with the complacency that comes with handling a firearm over-and-over again as you holster and unholster a firearm throughout the day, its not surprising that many of these officers are saying it just went off as a negligent discharge can cost them their job if it lead to serious injury or property damage. Thinking its okay to wrap a loaded gun in a towel and toss it into a gym bag is what we get when departments refuse to hire candidates who score too high on IQ tests. Just because someone shoots hyper-unrealistic 3 gun competition, subscribes to Recoil magazine and routinely watches their fave rave YouTube cult of personality channel shill for the latest company that paid him off doesnt make them a [emailprotected]$$. If it were a lowered tier manufacturer like a Taurus having allegations made against them, people would run with it without thinking twice. The Glocks trigger had caught on a fold in the leather holster and it pushed the trigger part way back. The 1911 had one added, the FN 1905 had one added in 1906. Its also beyond debate that current production Sig quality is drastically inferior to what it once was, particularly the German made pieces. I call b-s on all these my gun magically went off. That said, I own multiple P320s, but all of them have the manual safety due to personal preference. Too Many Accidents On Nov. 5, 2020, a recently-purchased SIG Sauer P320 pistol went off unexpectedly at a training range in Dwyer Hill, outside of Ottawa. Had a buddy, years ago, that was a deputy for Orange County in California. The company didnt want to comment on any specific pending litigation for obvious reasons. A fellow kept his DA revolver in the desk. This is just blind greed using some careless doofus to sell a lie and cash in because a civil jury, like the average American voter, can be manipulated easily though emotion, tears and stories of anguish, pain and suffering at the foot of some super-rich evil corporations cold-blooded behest. Profits over reliability and you end up with junk. Sig P320 Accidental Discharge Problem - Topic One hell of a conspiracy. And people have a way of looking for ways to deflect blame for those discharges, especially when they stand to lose their job as a result. The settlement requires the gunmaker to reimburse owners of . The drop-bang thing only happened at a very narrow event window, it was only once the Internet doom-preachers figured out that narrow window and did it over and over online did it appear to be a thing. Sig adapted and changed the pistol sufficiently to prevent even that issue. I agree. They simply have never been seen in the upper echelon of handgun makers, their entire business model is to offer cheaper guns at cheaper prices. Then when the gun still wouldnt operate right, field stripped it and cleared the debris, but didnt understand the gun enough to realize it was now super broken. I wouldnt be surprised if she did it intentionally, she clearly suffers from a serious case of media whoring. Instead we see a Sig that is ran by Mr. Cohen of Kimber fame have repeated quality and product development failures. COPYRIGHT 2021, THETRUTHABOUTGUNS.COM. Cops are crap with guns, unlike me, a REAL pistolero! The Defiant regardless of who is the captain. (The defect couldnt be duplicated after the crash.). Pity that some of the most common reactions fall into two over simplistic categories: 1. There are several stories about her in the news for various no reasons, she must be throwing them out by a dozen. After all, there are limits on complying with Rule 2 and even Rule 3, because a gun muzzle is ALWAYS covering something, somewhere, and ALWAYS knowing what lies beyondperhaps FAR beyonda possible target is an impossibility. Second, pardon us if were more than a little skeptical that the P320 in question or any other handgun fired when it was out of battery. This guy had been working at the LGS for over a decade and never had an AD or ND, he was the strictest when it came to safety. In June, Cambridge police Lt. Thomas Ahern filed suit, accusing Sig Sauer of selling a dangerously defective product after his P320 fired on its own while he was in the department's SWAT team van with six other officers. No you haters are not smarter than the US military, who tested the P320 far more than your favorite YouTuber ever did. Depending on who you talk to you will get many different answers. LEO handguns get into struggles, they get laid and rolled on, they get smacked into vehicles/doorways, they get dropped, they get drawn and holstered way more often than their civilian counterparts. Slowly people are realizing they arent the only ones having issues. That could happen easily. Mechanical engagement of sear to striker not deep enough (wanted lighter, smoother trigger pull without giving it any hand workmanship required with the deep notch much safer classic systems made since 1900) Result another big fail. Miraculously, no one was hit by the bullet, which ricocheted around inside the vehicle. Ever since the internet went mainstream I have read about the Sigs decline. Note the addition of ominous background music in the second seven-minutes-longer version (there was no music in the Good Morning America version). 1) The p320 doesnt hold the striker fully to the rear. . This highly trained Fibbie was doing flips while dancing (breakdancing? The incidents occur outside the forbidden zone, as we disarm before we enter so we stay in assiduous compliance with their nonsensical requirement. They both underwent full testing but while the Sig was the cheaper handgun ($1.50), it also quoted higher costs for magazines and spare parts, boosting the overall cost of the acquisition. Theres also an un-named Texas gun shop manager who says a P320 fired as he cleared the weapon, blowing off one of his fingers. Fine. In my opinion, the only reason SIG would have done that is if they knew there was a safety problem with the original gun, otherwise they would not have done it., Scott says Harrison reviewed the claims in Officer Hiltons lawsuit and said, its unclear to (Harrison) what could now be causing misfires in the upgraded guns., Scott then asked Harrison if he believes the P320 should be removed from the marketplace. Yesterday, a Canadian news outlet, CBC News, published a story regarding the unintended discharge last year of a SIG P320 by a Canadian Special Operator, resulting in injury and his unit withdrawing the pistol from service. abprototype.com can add the manual safety as well as add the notches in the grip frame. Theyve also been adopted as duty guns by law enforcement agencies across the country. I have no idea. It sounds the same as arguing whether Captain Marvel could beat Superman up in a fist fight its pretty absurd and laughable. Legal Penalties. TTAG talked to SIG Sauer about the P320 suits and the ABC reports. Thats SIGs term for a recall. Not just police in US had issues with sig p320. It takes time for any new platform to work the kinks out. He likens it to a bow-and-arrow, pulled taut. It alleges that Walter Collette, Jr., a police officer with the Somerville (Mass.) Too much MIM in that crap SIG, the old ones were great. In 2021 you would think a company would understand MIM metallurgy. Not only is it now the designated sidearm of all branches of the U.S. military, there are over a million of them in civilian hands. Someone is going to read this thread and be bewildered. Keep your finger off the trigger unless you are ready to shoot. UPDATE:We were just made aware of YouTuber BoomStick Tactical who produced this video the day before our post published. When he put his hand on the grip, the weapon fired, according to the lawsuit. Sig Sauer Refuses to Recall Its P320 Handgun - The Stoddard Firm Sig Sauer's P320 is widely used by police departments across the country, and is a big seller in the civilian market, with about half a million sold nationwide. The problem with Sig is with their polymer pistols. The Glocks lack of a manual safety has caused untold thousands of needless cripplings and death. Ditto; that's what i was getting at earlier Bear007 Custom Aug 25, 2021 #18 The SIG will be the shortest military contract for guns in history. selling the 365 with strikers breaking? never got into the P320 It is to me a Range gun not a carry gun. The cheap seats were $100-$200 and you got to watch Wrath of Khan with Shatner. When he put his hand on the grip, the weapon fired, according to the lawsuit. Post again when you buy a real gun that you can defend yourself with. While this incident occurred months ago, this erroneous media report is driven by multiple sources, including our competitors, and coincides with the imminent release of other Canadian military and law enforcement tenders, indicating the timing of its release is an attempt to improperly influence the procurements, the statement said. Then theres the fact that the branches of the military have put the P320 design through their own batteries of testing and found it duty worthy. At least the Lion roars when he is hungry, the C.E.O smiles at you and when you turn your back he puts a knife right into it. I just separate Shatner the man from Kirk the character, which he plays with Shakespearian operatic perfection. BTW it was HK that made the first polymer gun, Glock actually stole the idea for the G17 from them. DND/CAF is not in a position at this stage in its investigation to offer insight into the potential causes because our investigation scope is broader than the technical aspect pertaining to the unintended discharge of the pistol.. And the fact they used real models, and big ones, gives the ships a real sense of heft, mass, movement and solidity that the garbage CGI ships of the new movies just cannot remotely compete with. Sig Sauer to Settle Lawsuit Over Alleged Safety Glitch in P320 Pistol In the former case, you would need upward movement coming to a sudden stop to bump up the drop safety at the same time you imparted rearward momentum to the gun to try and move the striker. When a consumer product is likely to be operated in such a way that it causes accidents because it is way too easy to make a serious mistake because of human error when operating it the manufactures are told that the machine must be made safer. Effectively: you must be this dumb to get this job. Everyone remembers the problems the Beretta M9 had, but it got sorted and they went on to serve over 30 years. Capitol Police Officers Explanation for Shooting and Killing Ashli Babbitt Is Riddled With Problems, The City of Wichita Raked In Almost $200,000 Selling Seized Guns in the Last Five Years, State Judge Issues Order Blocking Enforcement of Illinois Firearms Ban Act Statewide, Federal Judge Grants Injunction Blocking Enforcement of ATFs Frame or Receiver Rule, Illinois Rep. Bob Morgan: Anything Stamped M&P is a Weapon of War, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-ZZ6pynGLM, https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/dea-agent-lee-paige-still-wont-go-away/, https://sofrep.com/news/dod-evaluation-says-armys-new-sig-sauer-p320-service-pistol-riddled-issues/, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0LUbLu6TqA, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsu6WsSQ2_g, https://millsentertainment.smugmug.com/William-Shatner-The-Wrath-of-Khan. Hey, Im sitting here staring at my P320, waiting for it to go bang! Lastly, ship-wise I have to go with the TMP-era refit Enterprise, regardless of Captain. Bagnell also represented Virginia Sheriffs Deputy Marcie Vadnais who sued SIG when she said her P320 went off on its own when she was removing the weapon from her belt. Vadnais was featured in the Nightline version of ABCs report. Dude, your story is THREE years old. OR some gorilla with more brawn than brains ignored the 40lb trigger pull they suddenly had to break the tab. 3. Fundamentally, the bits that the ambulance chaser claims are flawed function exactly the same way as a S&W M&P. About $300. Unless they have to fire their weapon in an on-duty incident most officers only fire their weapons just before and/or at qualifications, which depending on the department are annual or semi-annual. Were not the only ones who have noticed the lawsuits. Is it? This will include an alternate design that reduces the physical weight of the trigger, sear, and striker while additionally adding a mechanical disconnector. And it doesnt take too much Googling to find plenty of reports of LEOs suing the Georgia company as well (see here, here, here, and here for just a few). Clients such as law enforcement officers whose negligent discharges could result in their being disciplined or fired unless it can be proven that the gun was at fault. And on the flip side of the coin is the decades of denial by Remington on the 700 which Ive seen firsthand. You have entered an incorrect email address! A plastic gun that has a tendency to go off by itself. At least the Gorilla is still evolving while the Far Right proved to be an evolutionary dead end, one of natures mistakes. CBC News reached out to Sig Sauer and its Canadian distributor, M.D. -You plan on getting rid of your P320, great! Hello perpetrators, Lee Paige is clearly the gift that keeps on giving though our buddy Hunter Biden is a close second! They wouldnt have adopted it if was. The suit also cites other occurrences of "un-commanded" discharges with the 320 while holstered. No, it doesnt. What exactly did Harrison mean by legal momentum? That isnt clear, but its easy to make an educated guess. These lawsuits ARE about SIG making defective weapons. Bagnell is representing a number of the police officers who have filed suits against SIG for un-commanded discharges, but wouldnt disclose the exact number. Circumstances that explained those un-commanded discharges.. And have the dropping 320 go off? (b) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor. Theyre cheering for a noose around their own precious Glocks throat. Search Texas Statutes. Theyre the only product that is not. That a pistol will be carried in a way it shouldnt (say, in a gym bag or a purse). People who know how to handle guns prudently and safely. So, unlike the Serpa holster debate, Im a believer that there is more going on than meets the eye with the P320 and is exactly why I refrained from buying one, why I still wont own one, and why I steer people away from it. Sep 20, 2021 613 571 Idaho. . Ron Cohen ruined Kimber and now hes doing the same to SIG. But as Officer Hilton says, There is no way anything could have gotten into my purseinto the trigger guard and pulled that trigger., This ABC report includes an interview with Joshua Harrison, a firearms expert hired by the network to examine the P320s design and give his opinion of its safety. SIG ultimately settled that lawsuit. They are being replaced with Glocks. He wanted to see how accurate the gun was, especially after the customer got it back after the voluntary upgrade. Happy with my old S&W revolvers, 3rd Gen S&W pistols,1911s and a slew of P226s. Without a loser pays tort system, such abuse will go on and on. The heads up testing was immediately finished the Sig was the winner.